Using ArchiMate, UML and BPMN together

[Model Trainer]

Hi everybody,

Is there any problem to use ArchiMate, UML and BPMN together? How would be the strategy to use it? If somebody has such an experience, I will appreciate to get some suggestions or even example files.

Thanks

[qwerty]

The only issue I see is, to take an analogy, writing your documentation in English, French and Spanish. Can be understood by anyone fluent in these languages. Guess what happens in reality.

q.

[Geert Bellekens]

Where I'm from that is very common.

Use Archimate for the Architecture, BPMN for the business processes, and UML for data modelling (all levels) and all functional/technical models.

We tend to use «trace» whenever we cross a language barrier (eg. between BPMN process and Archimate applicationcomponent, etc..)

Geert

[qwerty]

Well, actually in a past project we used UML, borrowed from SysML (and little from BPMN) and created an own profile. But that was ONE language, not a wild mix of three.

q.

[Geert Bellekens]

Well, actually in a past project we used UML, borrowed from SysML (and little from BPMN) and created an own profile. But that was ONE language, not a wild mix of three.

q.

We don't use a "wild" mix either. Each domain/level has specific (documented) rules about what elements and what relations are allowed. We generally only use a small subset of UML/ArchiMate/BPMN
Depending on the needs and budget/time constraints, I often create dedicated profiles as well to help the user create correct models.

Geert

[Model Trainer]

Thank you so much guys for your responses. Here I have a question from my manager regarding choosing another language besides UML, which we used for modelling App portfolio and Biz capabilities. And I should provide them a proposal about that to address which one is more suitable?? BIZBOK, ArchiMate, or even TOGAF or BABOK. Or as an alternative, a combination of them. With considering this limit that we're going to use Erwin for our data modelling. Do you have any suggestion to provide a solution here? @Geert can you please provide me with more info about how you used the combination of languages in your project(s)?
Thanks

[Modesto Vega]

Well, actually in a past project we used UML, borrowed from SysML (and little from BPMN) and created an own profile. But that was ONE language, not a wild mix of three.

q.

We don't use a "wild" mix either. Each domain/level has specific (documented) rules about what elements and what relations are allowed. We generally only use a small subset of UML/ArchiMate/BPMN
Depending on the needs and budget/time constraints, I often create dedicated profiles as well to help the user create correct models.

Geert

I think combining parts into a single profile is the key. It is very rare to use UML, ArchiMate or  BPMN in its entirety.

Thank you so much guys for your responses. Here I have a question from my manager regarding choosing another language besides UML, which we used for modelling App portfolio and Biz capabilities. And I should provide them a proposal about that to address which one is more suitable?? BIZBOK, ArchiMate, or even TOGAF or BABOK. Or as an alternative, a combination of them. With considering this limit that we're going to use Erwin for our data modelling. Do you have any suggestion to provide a solution here? @Geert can you please provide me with more info about how you used the combination of languages in your project(s)?
Thanks

I am partial to combining selected ArchiMate concepts with a pinch of UML, it is a very powerful custom descriptive language.

[Geert Bellekens]

Thank you so much guys for your responses. Here I have a question from my manager regarding choosing another language besides UML, which we used for modelling App portfolio and Biz capabilities. And I should provide them a proposal about that to address which one is more suitable?? BIZBOK, ArchiMate, or even TOGAF or BABOK. Or as an alternative, a combination of them. With considering this limit that we're going to use Erwin for our data modelling. Do you have any suggestion to provide a solution here? @Geert can you please provide me with more info about how you used the combination of languages in your project(s)?
Thanks

Here's an example of a metamodel poster for a client. This is not meant to be complete, but to give people a good idea of how the model ties together at a glance


Geert

[Model Trainer]

Thanks a lot Geert. It helped me very much. And how can we distinguish that which modelling language is used in each of these layers? and also what about high-level models like what we have for biz capabilities and their connection with applications?
I'm really struggling how to connect capabilities and apps together to show them in a way that apps are embodied in a capability, by clicking on the App icon on the capability I can go through its diagram. Sorry if my questions seem idiot I'm so new to the EA modelling.
Also I have another question, if we set a "Realization Stereotype" to a connector for connecting a UML-based component to an ArchiMate-based capability, would it be a problem?

[Geert Bellekens]

Thanks a lot Geert. It helped me very much. And how can we distinguish that which modelling language is used in each of these layers? and also what about high-level models like what we have for biz capabilities and their connection with applications?
I'm really struggling how to connect capabilities and apps together to show them in a way that apps are embodied in a capability, by clicking on the App icon on the capability I can go through its diagram. Sorry if my questions seem idiot I'm so new to the EA modelling.
Also I have another question, if we set a "Realization Stereotype" to a connector for connecting a UML-based component to an ArchiMate-based capability, would it be a problem?

Your questions aren't idiot, but I'm afraid a bit too broad to be answered on a forum like this. You might want to consider hiring a consultant to help you through this.
That will be an investment now, but guaranteed to pay itself back if it can put you in the right track from the beginning.

Geert

[wivel]

What Geert said 

You can mix and match all you like, but to make it fly, you need to figure out what you want to achieve and define a model for it, as  the one Geert shared. That is the hard, but also fun part. EA doesn't help you in that area and I too will suggest getting outside help.

Henrik

[Viking]

Hi everybody, Is there any problem to use ArchiMate, UML and BPMN together? How would be the strategy to use it? If somebody has such an experience, I will appreciate to get some suggestions or even example files. Thanks

Notations shouldn't be mixed for several reasons. A profile might be a solution what you are looking for. With the corresponding shape scripts, the same element is shown in Archimate as an Archimate element, in BPMN as a BMPN element, etc.