Author Topic: v15.1 - Where is EA-Lite?  (Read 11203 times)

Paolo F Cantoni

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v15.1 - Where is EA-Lite?
« on: April 10, 2020, 01:22:51 pm »
We are about to roll-out 15.1 but we can't find the EA-Lite version for 15.1.  The only version of EA lite we can access via the web site (https://www.sparxsystems.com/bin/EALite.msi) is v14.1.

Can some kind soul provide a link to the EA lite version for v15.1 (preferably 1528, but any 15.1)?

@Sparx, why is it so hard to find EA-Lite for the latest version? 

Paolo
« Last Edit: April 10, 2020, 03:16:40 pm by Paolo F Cantoni »
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Eve

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Re: v15.1 - Where is EA-Lite?
« Reply #1 on: April 14, 2020, 09:25:51 am »
It's not on the website because we haven't released one a reader since 14.1.
Eve

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Paolo F Cantoni

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Re: v15.1 - Where is EA-Lite?
« Reply #2 on: April 14, 2020, 09:48:42 am »
It's not on the website because we haven't released one a reader since 14.1.
This makes it REALLY tough for us. We're encouraging users to start with EA-Lite (they're shirt scared of breaking the enterprise model when they first come on board) and when they feel more comfortable and up to "getting their feet wet", they can transition to EA-Full (with no loss of generality or changes in thought).

The menus keep changing (especially between v14 & v15+) and so that's a false promise!  It's hard enough to get (potential) users to look at models - look at the Coronavirus examples, without "shooting ourselves in the foot" with changing menus - and to a lesser extent functionality - because what they're using is MANY versions behind!

Please, please, release a v15 EA-Lite (and very soon)!

Paolo
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Eve

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Re: v15.1 - Where is EA-Lite?
« Reply #3 on: April 14, 2020, 10:37:11 am »
Solve that problem giving them a login with zero permissions.
Eve

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Paolo F Cantoni

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Re: v15.1 - Where is EA-Lite?
« Reply #4 on: April 14, 2020, 11:26:31 am »
Solve that problem giving them a login with zero permissions.
In case you hadn't noticed, that requires a licence (doesn't it).  We recently priced some more licences and my manager nearly fainted.  Not that EA isn't worth the amount (you might well think that, I couldn't possibly say that  ;)).  In addition, just so we're clear, the concept of having to pay a full licence to get a "crippled" outcome (see 169Mb for full version vs 40 Mb for Lite) is galling!

One of EA's selling points which we've heralded was that readers-only can use EA Lite and NOT consume a licence - and indeed EA Lite is supplied, it's just 5-6 releases behind the current!  In the current situation, almost as useful as the proverbial "tits on a bull".

We are going to purchase licences as our real user base (model editors, as opposed to "lurkers") grows.  Don't make it harder for us to promote the concept!

Paolo
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Eve

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Re: v15.1 - Where is EA-Lite?
« Reply #5 on: April 14, 2020, 12:43:52 pm »
Well, that's a different concern from your previous issue.

Yes, it means that you will be consuming a license. By doing that you get the same UI, you don't need to later install a different product in order to swap roles, you can also be a reader for one model and an author in another. That seems to outweigh the size so I have trouble with your argument that it's a "crippled" outcome.

In case you haven't noticed, PCS, WebEA, and Prolaborate are being pushed by us as a preferred reader method over EA lite. It will have a different UI, but a much simpler one. It also doesn't require any install for on the client machines. Of course it's still not free.
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Paolo F Cantoni

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Re: v15.1 - Where is EA-Lite?
« Reply #6 on: April 14, 2020, 03:43:03 pm »
Well, that's a different concern from your previous issue.

Yes, it means that you will be consuming a license. By doing that you get the same UI, you don't need to later install a different product in order to swap roles, you can also be a reader for one model and an author in another. That seems to outweigh the size so I have trouble with your argument that it's a "crippled" outcome.

In case you haven't noticed, PCS, WebEA, and Prolaborate are being pushed by us as a preferred reader method over EA lite. It will have a different UI, but a much simpler one. It also doesn't require any install for on the client machines. Of course, it's still not free.
Yes, I have noticed but...
  • I'm trying to get EA established with the tech community at my new employer - PCS, WebEA and Prolaborate are too much of a change from what I know works.
  • They are on my roadmap, but downstream.  In the meantime, I thought I had the fall-back position of EALite.  I've successfully transitioned sceptics via EALite to full flavour EA in the past.
  • I don't think the use cases are the same.  Similar, I grant you, but different audiences.
  • Until this last version, we wouldn't be having this discussion.  Since (as far as I can tell) Sparx hasn't formally deprecated EALite (or is this the "Clayton's" deprecation?), I would have expected to download the latest, UI compatible, viewer.  The compatibility thing being paramount, I want these users to transition seamlessly to EA Full.  With the other options, you can't. As you'll be well aware, any friction can derail this kind of endeavour.

Again, please provide a v15 viewer.

Paolo
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Graham_Moir

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Re: v15.1 - Where is EA-Lite?
« Reply #7 on: April 17, 2020, 09:28:22 pm »
It's not on the website because we haven't released one a reader since 14.1.
This makes it REALLY tough for us. We're encouraging users to start with EA-Lite (they're shirt scared of breaking the enterprise model when they first come on board) and when they feel more comfortable and up to "getting their feet wet", they can transition to EA-Full (with no loss of generality or changes in thought).

The menus keep changing (especially between v14 & v15+) and so that's a false promise!  It's hard enough to get (potential) users to look at models - look at the Coronavirus examples, without "shooting ourselves in the foot" with changing menus - and to a lesser extent functionality - because what they're using is MANY versions behind!

Please, please, release a v15 EA-Lite (and very soon)!

Paolo

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Paolo F Cantoni

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Re: v15.1 - Where is EA-Lite?
« Reply #8 on: April 21, 2020, 03:48:23 pm »
The silence is deafening - including from Support.

I suggest some Sparxians try to set up a v14.1 EA Lite to (co)operate in a v15.1 environment.  It's not for the fair hearted!  I can't make it work as I need.  I never noticed how dependent the setup of EA Lite was on the related Full version (because the two were kept - in sync).  Once you've moved on from the version of EA lite with EA Full, it's quite problematic.

Paolo
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Eve

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Re: v15.1 - Where is EA-Lite?
« Reply #9 on: April 21, 2020, 04:35:26 pm »
The silence is deafening
I gave up, you wouldn't accept the answer that you were given.

I can't make it work as I need.

Are you referring to more issues than the UI being different?

Did we ever promise that a reader would always have the same menu structure as an editor?
Eve

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Paolo F Cantoni

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Re: v15.1 - Where is EA-Lite?
« Reply #10 on: April 21, 2020, 09:34:56 pm »
The silence is deafening
I gave up, you wouldn't accept the answer that you were given.

I can't make it work as I need.

Are you referring to more issues than the UI being different?

Did we ever promise that a reader would always have the same menu structure as an editor?
That's not what I said.  For example, have various workspace layouts for certain screens 1, 2, 3 screens in various configurations. 
I expected to be able to set them up and then save them.  Can't do that any more (as far as I can see) I believe we could do that in earlier versions.  This is a pretty simple requirement for a viewer.  but I can't even do that AFAIK.

I'm sure there will be other areas such as that where in the past, we set up the Full version and then "hijacked" the settings for the Lite version.

Please don't tell me I need to have a full v14 just to configure the v14 Lite!

Paolo
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Re: v15.1 - Where is EA-Lite?
« Reply #11 on: April 22, 2020, 07:35:42 am »
It helps to know what you're trying to do.

Yes, workspace layouts are often incompatible between versions. You won't be able to configure workspace layouts in 15 and use them in 14.
Eve

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Paolo F Cantoni

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Re: v15.1 - Where is EA-Lite?
« Reply #12 on: April 22, 2020, 08:20:06 am »
The silence is deafening
I gave up, you wouldn't accept the answer that you were given.
Well, the answer said the alternatives were the preferred answer - it's what you didn't say that was important.  The implication of using the word preferred is that the less preferred option is viable.  Our experience is that it isn't - certainly without massive efforts and inconvenience on our part.

So it's a case of you can have any version of EA Lite, so long as it's v14.1.

We'll have to adjust our plans accordingly.

Paolo
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potterm

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Re: v15.1 - Where is EA-Lite?
« Reply #13 on: June 09, 2021, 02:28:29 am »
Another vote for EA lite to be updated (to 15.2 now).  I'm in discussion with my customer about how they can access the engineering model we're building for them, initially read-only as they need an easy way to review the full model.  Longer term I think they're quite preparared to pay for licenses, and this could extend to a scenario where our team and theirs start to collaborate in-model, but for the time being the EA-Lite route is an attractive, low commitment route as it allows them to get to grips with the model + tool before spending money.

So I was disappointed to see that EA-Lite hasn't been updated since v14.  Why isn't it being updated in-line with each EA release?  This is a strong selling point for EA, but I'm now thinking that I'll have to "unsell" this feature to my customer as I don't want to risk them seeing a different user interface and/or have the model rendered in a different way for them than for us.  The above is a clear example of how it can lead to further take-up and sales.  Isn't that the point?

qwerty

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Re: v15.1 - Where is EA-Lite?
« Reply #14 on: June 09, 2021, 06:50:27 am »
I think they are targeting the web interface in order to increase revenue. It's all about money, you know.

q.